The creators of Netflix’s hit show Wednesday, Al Gough and Miles Millar, detail what went into creating the smash hit second season. Based on cartoonist Charles Addams’ original creation, Wednesday follows Wednesday Addams (Jenna Ortega) as she continues to navigate the perilous Nevermore Academy. In this interview with The Contending, Gough and Millar reveal how the structure of this season changed, in particular how they approached the mystery this time around.
They also dive into the great serendipity of Lady Gaga making a song for the show just when her album Mayhem came out and how that helped both of them. Finally, they talk about how much fun it is digging into Addams Family lore and finding new ways to express what makes this iconic family so interesting.
The Contending: One of the first things about the second season that I was really impressed with was the introduction of Agnes. Adding a new main character to a show is always risky, but I like the way she started out as this stalker fan girl of Wednesday that Wednesday is mainly annoyed by, but uses her while Enid belittles her as creepy. She later progresses to having a sense of doubt, and her scene in the Sum of Our Parts therapy session was really touching. She gets to the point of being an actual friend and not just a fangirl, and has that great dance sequence with Enid as they accept each other. Where did the idea for her come from?
Al Gough: We wanted a younger character who in some ways reflected a lot of the fan base. A younger teen who looked up to Wednesday (and who Wednesday would find very annoying), but who also came between Wednesday and Enid. Wednesday and Enid had their hug at the end of season one; they are friends now but Wednesday doesn’t really understand what having a friend is. Then you add the Agnes factor into it and it adds a lot more complexity. What you said is exactly what we hoped for, which is at first you think oh, she’s annoying. Who is this girl coming between these two characters that we love? But then you grow to love her.
We loved that Sum of Our Parts scene as well. It was also the emotional fulcrum of the season, and the fact that it’s so absurd that you have these amputated limbs, ears, eyeballs, and a professor who is just a head in a jar. It was a scene that felt like it could be a Charles Addams cartoon in the New Yorker and captures the graphic nature of the comedy within the show. But it is also incredibly moving, heartbreaking, and somehow feels very real and a great arc for Agnes.
The Contending: You were able to create another iconic dance sequence this season, and Lady Gaga created a song for it instead of having fans add one of her songs to the first season’s dance sequence. What was your thought process in doing another dance sequence? Were you worried about doing it again? Did you feel you had to?
Miles Millar: We didn’t feel like we had to do it again and we weren’t going to do it just to do it. That being said, music is a very important part of the show. Because of what happened with the viral dance scene from season one, Lady Gaga had reached out and said she had written a song for the show, and we heard it and loved it. We also already knew we had the gala episode and so that would fit perfectly with a new dance sequence. When we heard the song the first time it was so catchy and the lyrics were perfect for the show so it was irresistible. Then the idea that Lady Gaga would come into the show as a character was something we weren’t sure was going to happen. But she was really interested in being a part of the show, and we had this role of Rosaline Rotwood that we thought was perfect for her. She was able to come to Dublin and just knocked it out of the park, and it was an amazing experience for us and the show.
Al Gough: The dance was different this time because it was two different characters and it was actually part of the plot of taking down Principal Dort. It didn’t feel like we were just stopping the show to have the dance; it was integral to the storytelling, both emotionally and on a plot level.
The Contending: Well, you already answered my next question about what it was like working with Lady Gaga because I am a huge fan and love her new album.
Miles Millar: It was perfect timing for us because the album blew up as the show happened! It was incredible synchronicity.
The Contending: You had multiple mysteries this season that are slowly revealed and solved throughout the season. Agnes’s stalking, Isaac’s return, the secret organization in the mental institution, and Morning song. What made you guys decide to take on all these mini mysteries?
Al Gough: The mystery was very successful in season one, and we were very grateful because we had never done a closed mystery before. But we knew we couldn’t just do one mystery of who did it for eight episodes again. They also told us early on that the season was going to be split, four episodes at a time. So we wanted a mystery where we could answer a bunch of questions in four episodes but then leave the door open for more mysteries. Then of course, Wednesday literally let out an asylum of people that would propel you into the back half of the show. You want the mystery to be complex so that it is intriguing, but not so much that people get confused and tune out. As we are laying it all out it can be touch and go, but we are happy the way it came together.
Miles Millar: There are some things we leave open in the end, some cliffhanger moments, but the actual mystery of the season is complete and you have the answers.
The Contending: So, being in The Addams Family world, you’re able to play around with some of the ideas that have been established to an extent. The idea that Pugsley also has the electronic power, that it is not just something Uncle Fester has, but all the Addams Family men. Or that Grandma Frump has her own Lurch. So what is your process when you’re digging into Addams’ Family lore?
Al Gough: What is great about The Addams Family is that it’s a family that people love but there isn’t really that much lore. There were literally no names for the characters until the television show in the 60s and then you had the movies. Even between those projects they change things like Uncle Fester was Gomez’s uncle in the show and in the movies Fester is Gomez’s brother. So nothing is hard and fast, so for us it is such a blank canvas. H. Kevin Miserocchi, who runs Tee and Charles Addams Foundation and is the keeper of the Addams estate, is very open to these ideas. Which has been great and has allowed us the freedom to answer some questions. We know Fester had electric powers in most versions, and we knew Pugsley was usually portrayed as very chaotic, and liked to blow things up. Then we thought, what if he did have the power but, if that was the case, then why didn’t Gomez?
Another great example is Thing. In the old panels there was just a shy person in the corner who you just saw a little bit of, and then in the TV show was the arm in the box, and then, of course, with the movies he was a disembodied hand just running all over the place. So it is an interesting thing to take some of the evolution the characters have gone through, and then go to the next level, and then reinterpret other aspects of it.
The Contending: One of the big introductions this season was Grandma Frump, and with her we get a continuation of the generational issues of mothers and daughters not getting along. Then there is the added detail that Wednesday gets along with her grandmother more than her mother. What is it about that issue that is so compelling to you, and wanting to add another generation to the problems?
Miles Millar: I think it just felt like the mother-daughter relationship between Wednesday and Morticia was so interesting to write in season one, even with Morticia only being in two episodes. So bringing the whole family into season two as season regulars really gave us more latitude to explore that dynamic. Then adding Grandmama felt like a different window into Morticia on Wednesday, and seeing how this threesome of women can operate. The casting of Joanna Lumley was just perfect for us. She brings so much class and is such a force of nature you totally buy her as Morticia’s mother and as Wednesday’s grandmother. We needed someone who could stand up to both, being intimidating but also funny. That is always the thing, because ultimately the show is a comedy. It has these mystery elements but every scene should be crackling with humor. That is just something Joanna brings in spades. To see the three of them working together was really magical.
The Contending: I can’t wait to see more of her. She was just fun every time I saw her on screen.
Miles Millar: I know. She just inhabits the role. The costume that Colleen Atwood designed was perfect, and I especially love the wig, which is Bride of Frankensteinish but not quite. It is so inspiring. She is already so iconic in that role it is incredible.
The Contending: Thing’s origin and how he feels about his place in the family was a big part of this season. Plus we found out he can get drunk somehow, which was quite enjoyable to see. What was behind the choice to give him that extra backstory this season? And were you worried about giving this mysterious character a backstory?
Al Gough: We weren’t worried. I think what was a pleasant surprise for us from season one was how much people loved Thing and how attached they were to him. The scene in episode seven of season one when Thing gets stabbed, people were just mortified. We got so many comments about God, I thought you were going to kill Thing! We thought, who do you think we are, animals? So the idea of exploring where Thing came from has been something fans have been asking for a while, and we had the same question and wanted to explore that. So that became the centerpiece in terms of the mystery this season of what we want to do with this character. Then the idea of Gomez losing his power as part of what brought Thing to life felt like a great way to tie it all together.
Then also the fact that his origins come from Nevermore, it really fit for the show. What we were worried about in season one was that people would figure out that Tyler was the hyde. We were just convinced that we weren’t going to be able to keep that hidden. It is one thing when you see it on the page, but when you shoot it you wonder if there are enough misdirects. So for season two, we thought somebody is going to realize that Isaac’s glove is not his hand. We had so many discussions about this. Owen Painter, who played Isaac, did such a brilliant job, and the reveal worked great.
Miles Millar: When you know the mystery it always feels like it’s so obvious, and the fact that the first thing you see of Isaac is his hand coming up. So if you’re looking it is set up in the first frame of his introduction. That was something we thought was kind of ballsy to do. But we knew that was going to be the twist at the end, and we just hoped we could get there without people being three steps ahead of us.
Al Gough: One other thing we added was the signet ring had the knight chess piece on it. So we wondered after people heard his name we wondered if they’d be able to to put it together.
Miles Millar: We kept getting notes from Netflix that you can’t have the ring, it’s too obvious. But people still didn’t get it, and it being obvious is the best thing about a twist. It’s like in the Sixth Sense when he is sitting at dinner and he is talking and she never responds. It seems obvious when you look back, and I think that’s the most satisfying kind of twist, where you mess with the audience because you told them the whole time if they just looked harder. It’s always a fun thing to do if you pull it off. You just never know, and it is torture waiting for the show to drop to see if you did it.
The Contending: In the first season you had Christina Ricci, and in the second season you have Christopher Lloyd. Do you have any other actors from the original movies that you’d like to get in the show?
Al Gough: We would love to get some of the others into the show. It’s just always about whether we have the right character and are they available. But we love that idea of paying homage to the other iterations of The Addams Family.
Miles Millar: On Smallville we brought in Christopher Reeve, and that was just one of the highlights of our career. It was a difficult logistical feat to get him into the show but it was also one of the best episodes of the series. It was a highlight. Then for the fans, it’s always a great call back while also being respectful to the legacy of what came before. We are here on the shoulders of that legacy of The Addams Family, and I think it’s always great to acknowledge them and express gratitude to those who have made this such an enduring franchise that people across the world love. The amazing thing about The Addams Family is that it has this global reach. Somehow everyone thinks they’re an outcast, a weirdo, and a freak, and that is what is so wonderful about The Addams Family that it really unites people in the sense of being freaks together. That is what we love about The Addams Family, the celebration of otherness and being an outsider and different. It is a wonderful sandbox to play in, and we are having the time of our life doing it.
Wednesday streams exclusively on Netflix.
