The character of Gemma/Ms. Casey on AppleTV+’s Severance initially provided one of the series’s big mysteries. The reveals and insight revealed during season two came, in large part, through the transcendent performance of Dichen Lachman. Here, in an extensive and insightful interview with The Contending, Lachman discusses the complexities of playing so many different versions of the character even if in small moments. She also reveals what she kept of Gemma in all the different versions, even on a subconscious level, which helps the audience feel for her in so many different situations. Be it her love of Mark or hatred of Lumon Industries, no matter who she was Dichen Lachman kept us engaged.
The Contending: Episode 7, “Chikhai Bardo,” gave much more detail about Gemma’s relationship with Mark, from their meet-cute to them being married and having problems but still loving each other. How did you and Adam Scott prepare to show so much of a relationship in such a little time?
Dichen Lachman: It was a lot of pressure, and I didn’t want to let anyone down. Obviously for the audience, they need to get really invested, one of the blessings was that we filmed that episode’s flashbacks at the very end of the season so that Adam and I got to work together a lot in episode ten and get to know each other and talk about the characters and just build that familiarity with each other. Honestly, I think it made a huge difference. They filmed it that way because they wanted the weather to be nice with flowers blossoming and the sun being out, but it had this wonderful by-product of establishing that deeper connection.
The Contending: The other part of episode seven is Gemma going into all these different severed rooms. So we are given little clips of you being slightly different versions of Gemma. What was that like to approach?
Dichen Lachman: It was nerve-wracking. I’ve done similar things in the past; this is so different because there’s a subtlety to this world. When I initially read the script I was, like, okay, wow, I really have to differentiate these characters. But then I realized that it has to be more grounded because the severance procedure doesn’t make you a totally different human being. You are a different part of yourself that doesn’t have access to the other parts of yourself. The process was helped with the team of people I had around. Ben (Stiller) is so talented, one of the most extraordinary people I’ve worked with, and one of his talents is finding extremely talented people. The hair and makeup, set design and production design, all of it together, really helped me differentiate the characters. Because there was so much attention to detail with the looks and all the journeys Gemma takes. Not to say that it isn’t challenging, but it helps inform you as the artist, their work helps inform you. I think everyone did an extraordinary job of helping to differentiate the space and the feeling.
The dentist scene went through the most changes out of all the scenes in episode seven, from when I first read it to what we ended up doing on the day. The scene was originally much longer with a lot more components involved, including at one point they were going to have the camera inside my mouth. Which I was like, oh, my God. who wants to see inside my mouth! [Laughs] Of course I was willing to do whatever they wanted to do, but things fell away and became more condensed. It was an interesting and thoughtful process for everybody.
The Contending: When you mentioned that you don’t entirely lose yourself in the severed moment, it reminded me of one of the things that sold me on Gemma’s torture in this place was every interaction with Dr Maurer (Robby Benson). Gemma hates him no matter which version of herself sees him. His cruelty to her especially in her room, saying that Mark had remarried and has a daughter, was particularly intense. Your hatred for him comes across so well. How did you get into that mindset?
Dichen Lachman: It started with the thread from season one that I was pulling out a little bit when Mark in the wellness center makes a little tree out of clay for Ms. Casey. That gave me a clue that these innies are tethered to something from their outies. So in Gemma’s case, because she has so many innies, they are connected to each other as well. So even though she doesn’t understand why it felt like there had to be some continuity in her subconscious. In the mind we compartmentalize, but with the technology of this world you can completely shut down that part of you. But this torture that he is putting her through, it had to be there in the background, that there’s just something about this guy. The dentist scenario is easy because he is actually doing the procedure. But in the Christmas scene it’s not like it’s the worst scenario to put somebody in, it’s not abject torture. But all of those other tortures I think are in the background, and there’s something about this guy she just detests.
The Contending: One of my favorite scenes this whole season is Gemma and Mark in the elevator making out and then the ding happens and they’re severed, and then it’s Ms Casey and Mark S., who are totally indifferent to each other. That had to be incredibly difficult to make that switch so quickly. I’m curious what it was like to shoot?
Dichen Lachman: I will say the switches were very hard, especially in episode 10, because there are such extreme situations happening to each character. That was actually a funny day and we had a lot of fun with that scene. Ben was so great and had a great sense of humor. He would just throw out little suggestions, and sometimes I could hear him laughing behind the camera. It was quite fun and a sweet little scene to shoot. Deep down I think even though Ms. Casey doesn’t understand what’s happening, part of her is excited that she is that close to Mark. For me personally, I’ve been building this idea that she is drawn to Mark even though she doesn’t understand exactly why, and she doesn’t know how to articulate the feelings. But there is this deep desire to be in his proximity.
The Contending: All season we have been building up to what is Cold Harbor. When we finally see the severed room of Cold Harbor we learn it is the crib that Gemma needs to disassemble, playing back to her saddest moment. With everything that was getting played up into that moment, did that put a lot of pressure on you when you approached that scene?
Dichen Lachman: It was a big moment in the story and we spent a lot of time on it. We went through a lot of different versions, not as many as the dentist scene, but it did change. There was some dialogue we lost but I don’t think you miss it because it’s a compelling scene. Adam is fantastic; it’s a heartbreaking performance by him. Obviously she’s in this innie state where there’s something about this that’s hitting on some nerves, but again she has no idea what is happening and why this man is covered in blood and why he’s in the room. It’s very scary for her, but again, part of that subconscious mind trusts him, because there’s something about him on a deep, deep level she recognizes. That is why they are doing all these tests; they want to see if the barrier holds. While it is holding to some degree, they’re not accounting for that sense of when you’re meeting someone and you’re, like, I swear I’ve met this person before. Or you’ll see someone and you’ll just feel, like, I think I don’t like that person or I do like that person, and it’s because they remind you of something you just can’t put your finger on. We spent a lot of time and care on that scene and I think it turned out really beautifully.
The Contending: With Gemma finally free from the severed floor, is there something you’re looking forward to for Gemma to be able to do?
Dichen Lachman: Oh, my gosh, I have fantasized about different things. But then with Dan and Ben and the team they are working with, I know that they will come up with something I didn’t even think of that is incredible. In season 1 I had so many ideas about what they would do in season two because we don’t communicate when they are crafting the story idea and you don’t know if the show’s going to be picked up for another season. But when I did get the scripts I was, like, oh, this is going in a direction I didn’t expect. Like episode four (“Woe’s Hollow”), I never could have predicted that. I’m just looking forward to exploring Gemma more. I hope we get to spend more time with her.
The Contending: I have to admit as a fan I can’t wait to see Gemma interact with Devin, Mark’s sister. We’ve heard her talk about her relationship with Gemma, and I’m just curious what it’s going to be like for them to reconnect.
Dichen Lachman: Absolutely! Jen (Tullock) and Michael (Chernus) are such wonderful actors, I’m so envious I haven’t really had an opportunity to work with them. Honestly, they are part of the heart of the show in terms of the memory of what Mark’s life was like with Gemma. The way that Ricken and Devin talk about Gemma in season 1 really helped inform me about her warmth and who she was. So yeah, it would be amazing to have more scenes with those guys, since so far we’ve only had one with them at the dinner table.
The Contending: We end this season with you screaming with such heartbreak for Mark to follow you out the door. What was it like getting in that mindset and selling that intensity to so many viewers?
Dichen Lachman: That was one of the more challenging days. You know we were talking about the transitions, and I don’t know if people find this interesting, but it really was the hardest thing because of the Zoe cam, which is this specific camera where a special guy has to come to set to operate this whole thing. It has this zoom function when a character goes into their innie or outie. Usually you are doing it in one place, and I always had to do it as I was moving, and when you’re walking you get shorter and taller as you take the steps. And, since the Zoe is so precise and has to have this certain feel, it was very difficult to go such a long distance and go from Ms. Casey, who is acting, like, okay, I guess I’m running away with you somewhere back to Gemma, who has just been in an elevator after being reunited with Mark. All of those emotional transitions and the physical transitions and getting the technical aspect of it right. I have done some physically challenging things in my work, but that was probably the hardest thing I ever had to do.
I remember feeling like, oh, my gosh, I’m going to get fired because I think I had to do it, like,15 times before I got it right. I am usually really good with technical stuff but it was just one of those things. So then turning around and calling for him was actually the less challenging part because it was just rooted in raw emotion. I think she figures out very quickly that he has had the procedure done. She’s very intelligent and she is just trying to break through the barrier. When something is rooted so strongly in raw emotion it is less challenging than when you’re layering on all these artificial things. I don’t know what a severed transition actually feels like, and we have to create and manufacture that in our emotions and then do the technical aspects of it. So banging on the door actually felt like a release, and it was really heartbreaking. It’s like the moment they first reunite outside of Cold Harbor. It’s one of those moments as a performer you get carried away with the story itself and how sad it is.
The Contending: Final thoughts?
Dichen Lachman: I am so grateful that you love the show. Without people loving the show we don’t get to share the experience. It’s really rewarding when people get invested in something that you know so many people have worked so hard on and made sacrifices for. I’m really grateful and happy that we got to chat.
Severance streams exclusively on AppleTV+.
